Sir and Ma'am (Part II)

Last week I asked for reader's opinion on sir and ma'am. I got some great responses. I thought it important to divide them up between the north and the south so that you see where the confusion comes in.

You will see, by reading these few comments, that people in the North find the responses of "Sir" and "Ma'am" contrived and forced. But for people in the South, they are essential to respect. I cannot agree more. I grew up in a home that did not use or require these phrases. That was in South Florida where life runs very similar to the North. (Southern Florida is very different from Central and Nothern Florida.)

When I moved to Kentucky, I found these words incredibly awkward and forced. However, after living in Kentucky for many years, not hearing them meant that a child was being rude. I actually did not and do not like being called ma'am by people, but not hearing it sounds wrong.

I think you can tell where this young person who wrote into me is confused. The words feel wrong to her. However, if she does not use them in the South, people will receive her comments as rude -- even if they are not intended that way at all.

What we are experiencing here are cultural differences. I am very used to them now moving from place to place so frequently (and especially when visiting different cultures). However, I think we forget that they are very present within our own country. People feel strongly that each side is doing it wrong. However, the truth is NO ONE is doing it wrong. They are simply doing it the way they believe it should be done.

Remember that cultural differences are simply that. The question is: what does  a person moving from the north to the south do to "fit in" correctly? In Turkey, it is considered incredibly rude to blow your nose in public. Should I go ahead and do it because that is the way my people do it. Or should I respect their viewpointe when in their "country"?

And to clarify a few things from our point of view:

• This truly is NOT a military "thing." Many of my friends do not require their children to say it.
• My children are required, more than "ma'am" or "sir" to say "please" and "thank you" and also to not interrupt. (We also are teaching them to put a hand on our leg to indicate they would like to intterupt. And Isaac uses "Excuse me" almost to excess.) To us, all of these things go together to show good manners.

Read on to hear what readers had to say. And feel free to comment (politely of course) about how you feel about this.

Here are the responses from the North:

I am from the north (Michigan) and when I read your post about the ma'am and sir thing, I had a different opinion so I'm glad that this young lady brought it up.

My husband and I are BIG on manners. We expect please, thank you, I'm sorry, excuse me, etc. We have taught our two daughters to use the words sir or ma'am when referring to someone like, "ma'am, may I ask you a question". BUT, we do NOT expect them to follow up EVERY request, question, etc with a sir or ma'am. For us, it is something to use only when referring to someone, and I don't feel you have to express who you are referring to each time you speak (especially when it's clear who you are addressing your statment to).
I actually saw Wendi's post and thought that sir and ma'am expectations were military driven and although can show respect from children, can also imply too high of expectations from parents? Does that make sense?

I expect my kids to be respectful (as many kids these days are NOT) but using sir and ma'am, at least in this area (as I was born, raised and currently live in the same county/state), are not necessarily expected.

Hope that helps... from the north.

Here's another:

Born and raised in New York (having gone to school in CT, NJ, and MA) and I find the "ma'am" and "sir" saying weird. As in, it makes me think of the military and feels/sounds VERY impersonal. I would never think to use it with my mother or father. Even my elderly relatives are referred to by Aunt/Grandpa/etc.

Growing up, my parents expected good manners, and my sister and I were taught from an early age how to speak with adults- make eye contact, be polite, speak clearly, etc. Saying ma'am/sir wasn't even on the radar of how to be polite.
And certainly when someone calls me ma'am I find it a little insulting, since in NY it's generally reserved for older women- and at 32, I feel much to young to be a ma'am.

I only use sir/ma'am when addressing a total stranger.

Sir I use for any man that is my age or older than me (for men younger than me I say 'young man').

Ma'am is only for women much older than me (ie elderly so as not to offend middle aged women who wouldn't like to be called ma'am)- otherwise I use miss or young lady.

A lot of times I use nothing and just say, "Excuse me, you dropped your scarf."

Having never spent any significant time in the South, I have no idea if I've been perceived as rude for not saying sir/ma'am. My inlaws live in NC and we've visited several times, gone to their church, met their friends. Nobody seemed to mind that I didn't say it. However, I'm in my 30s, maybe their expectations for a teenager would be different.

And another:

I'm a Colorado born/raised/lived 90%+ of my life. As a northerner, those two terms are not expected and are, at times, seen as someone being sarcastic. (A Texas friend of mine was called to school for a first/only ever disciplinary action for their child who "dared" to used "yes, ma'am" in class - smart mouthed dilinquent! That child was a southern-raised, brilliant student and the teacher learned a very valuable lesson that night.

I now live in the south (sad to admit) and I have found it surely is expected from my 14 yr old at school! He rebels against the terms and most of the time, as long as he is respectful, it isn't an issue when they realize he isn't from the south. Howver, when push comes to shove, he can pull it out of his mouth and comply...stubborn teen!

As for the real point of this lesson...though it is considered the height of polite, when it rolls off the tongue without a thought, is it really being polite or simply complying to get the heck out of Dodge? Food for thought...

And here are some responses from our southerners:

Grew up in California but lived in Louisiana and Texas in our military wanderings. If you don't want to be considered ill-bred and rude, you should always use "sir" and "ma'am" following "yes" and "no" when speaking to someone in a position of respect (age, boss/employee, adult/child, employee/customer). You don't necessarily have to throw it into other speech (i.e., "How are you doing, ma'am"), however it is good practice.

When I was interviewing for a teaching position in Louisiana, the principal actually pointed out to me in an extremely tactful way. I replied with "Thank you sir." :D

And here is another:

I was born and raised in GA where Maam and Sir is required at anytime you are speaking to an adult. It is to be used without sarcasm. We moved to Ohio when I was 16 and it was not well received up North as it was seen as a sarcastic move no matter the tone of voice. We are still in Ohio but are teaching our boys (and girl) to say Maam and Sir since it was such a large part of my upbringing.

And another:

I was born, raised, and live in south Alabama. We grew up saying ma'am and sir and we require/expect that our children (3 1/2 and 10 mo (not her yet obviously)) to say it as well. As adults, my husband and I still answer to elders with ma'am and sir out of respect. If I were a teenager moving from the north to the south, I would make an effort to use it. I would use it in school, at church, and other social settings, when meeting new friends' parents, etc. Your parents may not ask that you answer them that way, however, in the south I would say most of us just think it is polite. It is much safer to use it in the south than to not use it.

And here are some inbetweeners:

It truly is part of the southern culture and fits there well but isn't practiced in the north (or here in Canada) unless you are referring to or addressing someone who's name you don't know. Respect is an attitude and people know if there is respect without "sir" and "ma'am". I don't think it hurts for students to use these with their teachers or professors though or other people in authority over them - not with partents and close friends though. There is my two cents.

And another:

I was raised in a military home, primarily in Texas. Oddly enough, we were never encouraged or made to say ma'am or sir. I personally don't really like to be called ma'am, but I do think young people should call adults Mrs. Smith or Mr. Jones instead of my first names. Plus, there are many other ways to show manners i.e. not interrupting two adults talking unless there is an emergency i.e. house on fire, blood, etc. I think please and thank you are essential manner words! I think children can be respectful without sounding like they are little mini-military personnel. Just my two cents worth....and now I live in Colorado.....